All religions teach people to do good: agree?

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Whenever there's any kind of debate about which religion is better, someone will always have to say "all religions teach people to do good". It's rather effective to stop me from further debate. Not because I agree but because there's no point in debating with someone who has his head in the ground.

Here is an example of why I disagree with that statement.

Many years ago in India "Under the devdasi system, girls were dedicated to a life of sex work in the name of religion. Initially, they would serve upper class men in the local community. The girls would entertain princes and landlords with song and dance. Gradually, this gave way to a life of prostitution. Many women, like Priya, end up in the red light districts of India's major cities." [Read more]

What good is sending children into prostitution? It is only good for the fathers to get income and perverts to sex.

Some people might say that it's not the religion but people who twist the religion to serve their own purpose. But what's a religion? We can't have religions if there were no people. If the people have twisted the religious teachings, then it is the failure of the religion to educate those people. Therefore, the religion has failed.

All religions teach people to do good. Sure. Someone always benefits.

11 comments:

Kelvin said...

Bad ppl without religion may not do good things, but good ppl uses religions to do bad things.

Savahn said...

May I return to your original debate regarding which religion is better?

That isn't a particularly good debate to be had because religion is personal. A person's relationship with the universe or higher power is "intimate". So attempting to discuss which is better can become very personal. And when things hit too close to home, it can become VERY bad.

If instead we start off trying to understand the other person's religion - it's fundamental values and key traits, that's the kind of discussion that is more valuable.

Also, expect every religious person's head to be stuck in the ground. Religious fundamentals form the core of a person's value system. It isn't just the head.

Finally, if one goes looking for the bad and ugly, one will find it without a doubt. Good or bad, religion exists. For example, materialism and consumerism are essentially atheistic religions that drive significant portions of society today.

David said...

Yu-Kym,

Finally I know your favourite fruit!

Cherries!

No doubt you are stunned and amazed by this insight.

I owe you an explanation.

Choosing the devadasi religious cult as you target of religion teaching either good or bad behavior the finest example of cherry picking a subject I have encountered in some time.

By some define devasi as a cult in which girls are "married" and dedicated to a deva or devil.

Simplifying this faith as a devil worshipping religion removes it farther from mainstream religions, into a true minority of strange religious cults. Devil worship is practiced in small cults of many extreme branches that have been driven away from mainstream religions.

Sadly I could not find any local devasi branch to confirm any of the practices you provided us with. Although a web search confirmed that devasis do indeed prepare girls for prostitution.
You did not however tell your readers that India outlawed devasi’s throughout India in 1988.

So while cherries can be either sweet or tart, devasis offer little to be valued our emulated.

What types of moral equivalency you are seeking establish in your post is now really muddied.
Let’s look at societies where religion plays no role.

The Peoples Republic of China for example.

The PRC has enforced, brutally at times through forced abortions, a one child policy. If a women gets pregnant with a second, third or fourth child, then an abortion will be forced upon women.

The most striking result of this one child per family policy is the rise of female infanticide. So great is the desire to have that one child be a male, that there in now a population imbalance of men and women of marrying age.

The PRCs country’s one-child policy, .has resulted in a reported birth ratio of almost 120 boys for every 100 girls.

By 2030, projections suggest that more than 25% of Chinese men in their late 30s will never have married. The coming marriage squeeze will likely be even more acute in the Chinese countryside, since the poor, uneducated and rural population will be more likely to lose out in the competition for brides.

Prostitution for example is legal in the Dutch city of Amsterdam. Some might find it surprising that this classy and pressure-free experience is actually (sort of) cheaper than the window girls in the Red Light District. In the RLD you’ll normally get what they call a “suck and fuck” for a standard €50, but this lasts only 15-20 minutes on a small bed and usually includes nothing more than you’ve distinctly agreed to beforehand.

At the private house brothels the usual hourly charge is €80 for a full hour, or €55 for half an hour, and this includes everything normal, although a bath (and sometimes even a shower) will cost from €10 to €40 extra.

If you have special desires that some girls might object to (and they often will object) then that will cost extra if they agree, but aside from that it’s all-inclusive.

It should be mentioned that prostitution is legal in other parts of Europe, although not on the scale one finds in Amsterdam.

The reason for prostitution being given a wink, wink, in the Euro zone is that Europe has been growing increasingly secular for more than 60 years.

Religion, with the exception of Islam, is now a minority activity in Europe. Sex one television, nude and topless beaches are found throughout the Euro zone.

So I ask Miss Loh this. Do secular societies offer anything better than ones with a varied and respected Religious foundation?

David

We humans are a hungry lot. We are driven by a craving to know
who we are. Yet who we are is embedded in the heart of a holy
God. Unless we seek for ourselves in the epicenter of God's
grace, we will be forever condemned to walk the arid edges of
self-understanding.


-- Calvin Miller

Anonymous said...

Oh NO! People are suing the Pope for covering up child sexual abuse in children. The Church in America has declared itself bankrupt so it doesn’t have to pay compensation. Numerous church “preachers” in USA has been found to be rapists and hypocrites.
USA has the world’s largest brothels, the world’s largest online porn XXX industry, and they choose the sex of the newborn by sperm selection technique ( i.e. killing the female baby before conception ). The world’s highest AIDS rate, the highest abortion rate and a paedophile kidnapped a girl and imprisoned her has his sex slave for over 16 years and fathered 2 kids with her until the law caught up with him. Now she is suing USA for negligence in not monitoring the sex offender at all! One shudders to think of what short of f**ked-up country is that! NO wonder they are bankrupt!

Anonymous said...

" girls were dedicated to a life of sex work in the name of religion" - you find a lot of religious cults in USA is preaching and practicing that too.

It is in the neewspaper all the time!

Savahn said...

LOL. David, we could argue that China's Communism is a religion in of itself. It has the classic characteristics of one.

And we would have grounds to support a counter-argument to Yu-Kim's proposition "All religions teach people to do good".

Anonymous said...

Just read in Bloomberg that some USA CEO’s are calling America to adopt the communism religion since they can’t compete with China.

The fact that a poor, backward, almost feudal country rose up from the ashes of years of colonial and foreign invasions (since 1840) with opium stuffed down their throats at the point of guns, and the opium had to be paid for in gold and silver which effectively bankrupted the country, then followed by Jap invasion and civil war, that country stood up from all these detriments and became one of the richest country in the world within a short period of only 60-70 years (literally within a person’s life time) and such miracle has never happened in past human history. Some commentators call her “The stealthy Super Power” since she is not acknowledging the fact she is a Super Power - that must be a bloody miracle from Mao’s Religion!

So companies in USA are calling people to embrace communism.

Isn’t it interesting the way the Wheel of History turns, that Western countries are now awash with illegal drugs, and you don’t need a gun to force it down their throats, and they are bankrupt!

Anonymous said...

India’s enforcement of the 1 child policy is far more brutal that China’s, more than any one can imagine. And David you are biased like any American.

Indian government used to simply pull people from the street and give them the snip. Now they entice people with transistor radios etc to get them to come in for the knife!

David said...

Several observations for the comments to date.

Anon, 25 Sept., yes the Church is being sued for past sexual abuse.

Sexual abuse is not unique to the United States, China, Thailand, Singapore, U.K., France or any nation. The nature of American media, and social media make news of any issue regarding sexual abuse.

In nations where media content is more controlled less is heard about the sexual abuse. Trust me when I state that sexual abuse of children is present in every nation.

Abortion and aids remain problems, and are yet to be dealt with justly. Simply put, abortion is a great crime against humanity. The primary means of AIDS transmission is casual sexual contact. ONS and such aid the spread of this disease.

As mentioned by Anon, India's one child policy is very brutal. Also mentioned is that Savahn said the PRCs type of communism is a form of religion. The same has been said of secular progressism in NA and the Euro zone.

It must be pointed out that the rulers of the PRC, while demanding respect, have never set themselves up as dieties or representatives of any god. The aurgument that communism is a religion does not meet the test of what a religion is typically. A set of political beliefs communism qualifies.

Whether communism of any type is a religion would be good discussion topic in another forum.

Anon, also points out that some CEOs in the States have called for a PRC style of communism. My research has found that what some American CEOs have called for is a return to the PRCs style of free market capitlasim. Take wind turbines as an example. In the
PRC a company interested in wind power can by land, purchase and erect wind turbines and hook them into the power grid. They can accomplish this often within one calendar year.

In the States one has to run a gamut of enviromental reviews, purchase several permits and likely face court challenges to build any type of wind turbine farm. Even individuals seeking to place a single wind turbine to power a home or small business can run afoul local laws restricting the heights of towers.

Most wind turbine projects in the States take at least 3 to 4 years from the initiation of a plan to build. Many wind turbines plans are scutteled due to expensive to litigate court challenges.

A bit long winded here, and I thank Yu-Kym for her indulgence.

David

Anonymous said...
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Jc said...

There's only 1 god, humans created many gods. Every generations have a say till this mess is caused. Who to blame?